Getting back into this

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8 years 9 months ago #137473 by olddawg
Getting back into this was created by olddawg
Shall we say, it's been a few 'moons' since I've rock climbed. I've updated much of my basic gear (including rope) and am researching what you folks have learned in the years.

I have climbed both SRT and DRT depending on the situation and could ascend either in the case required. Only once was a necessary, how do you say it.. Open Air.

Tree ascension is to me Open Air.

So I set up on my first tree running through my knots and system to see what I remember and what I need to work on.

My anchor knot is my tried and true and worked well.
The Blake's failed...

Since my old rope is Dynamic (what I'm used to) and my new is static (bought it for doing just this).. I'm seeing it just doesn't have enough flex to grab.

Disappointing.. I really wanted that tail on a Blake's. It's worked so well in the past.

Short of going to 'split tail'..
Have another suggestion I can run through?

Have no issue with split tails as back-ups, just never used them as 'life support'.
I'm seeing you folks are very comfortable with them..

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8 years 9 months ago #137474 by olddawg
Replied by olddawg on topic Getting back into this
Just a quick note.
I did work with my Cousin's Petzl ascender yesterday. Used them in the past, but never did like them over a good grab knot.
Just that whole sharp points in my rope that bothers me..

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8 years 9 months ago #137477 by olddawg
Replied by olddawg on topic Getting back into this
So far talking to myself..

Took some of my 6mm and worked with this VT (Valdotain Tresse).
Very interesting knot.
Grabs nicely, releases nicely.

I do like the doubled-up line.
I like how compact it is.
I really like the ease of tying.

Have another I should look at?

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8 years 9 months ago - 8 years 9 months ago #137478 by patty
Replied by patty on topic Getting back into this
Hi RJ--

Welcome to the TCI Forums. You are not talking to yourself! The situation is that a number of the people who participate here are getting ready to travel to the Tree Climbers Rendezvous, which for some starts tomorrow in Oregon and for others starts on Thursday in Seattle. It's also the height of tree work season, and our arborist participants are working themselves to the bone, in hot weather. By the end of the day, they don't have much energy for anything, much less the TCI Forums. Hang (pun intended) in there -- folks will give you feedback.

By the way--I don't know why your Blake's hitch failed, but it's possible that you tied a "suislide knot" rather than a good Blake's. Check your configuration! And no doubt others will comment.

All the best,
patty jenkins
Last edit: 8 years 9 months ago by patty.

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8 years 9 months ago #137481 by olddawg
Replied by olddawg on topic Getting back into this
Had a feeling it was something like that. Thank you for your response.

I tied my Blake's on my dynamic rope (ran through it a few times..) and worked well. Reason I assume the Static line is just too rigid. Ran through the Blake's again last night in the garage (have a test area in there).

With that said, the VT is working very well!

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8 years 9 months ago #137483 by ccanfield2312
Replied by ccanfield2312 on topic Getting back into this
Hey olddawg, I've been playing around with the VT too, as well as what I've seen called the XT which was an extra twist on the split tail before wrapping around the climbing line. Another one I've been playing with is a klemhiest. I'm finding issues with my climbing rope and my split tail ropes.

I'm working around with a rope wrench for SRT and trying to find the right setup before I do some big climbs. It would be good to hear input to see what you find successful!

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8 years 9 months ago #137486 by olddawg
Replied by olddawg on topic Getting back into this
Hello there CC!

First, I will let others here speak as professional and me as just an old guy getting back into this.

I will try this XT and see what it does for me. The VT I find will jam when used with a, how do you guys say it, a chaser. A line to collect the slack (yes, I'm working DRT).
I'm finding 4-6 good runs and then jams. It may be my split tail is not lengthen correctly or I'm hooking in wrong.

The Klemhiest to me is a haul rope knot. I passed on it as a 'Life Support' due to only a line (loop). VT has two tails, then doubling the strength of the rope.
Take care in what you use it for.

Schwabisch is my next test. Like the Valdotain, two tails, twice the value.
A little more compact and may work better for 'my' need.

I will of course refer you to those that have been here and current knowledge of thus.

PS I've looked at this rope wrench.. Just not sure. Hopefully someone that has experience with it will chime in.

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8 years 9 months ago #137487 by olddawg
Replied by olddawg on topic Getting back into this
I just an opportunity to try this Schwabisch. So far no jams, but haven't put it under a real hard test.
This one I'm starting to like so I'll ask those that use.

How do you feel about it for a 'Life Support' knot.

Looks like a good, again how do I say, 'Stepper knot' to ascend, but 'Life Support'?

Do you use it?
How do you feel about it?

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8 years 9 months ago #137488 by ccanfield2312
Replied by ccanfield2312 on topic Getting back into this
I've played around low and slow with the rope wrench today some more. Moss, on this site recommended to me the Michoacan or Cooper's Hitch to try out with the wrench, possibly two other hitches for you to try?

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8 years 9 months ago #137494 by olddawg
Replied by olddawg on topic Getting back into this
Thank you CC!
Tried both and a few variations of the Michoacán.

Schwabisch has become my new prusik style knot.
Simple to tie, holds very well and directional.

http://www.netknots.com/rope_knots/schwabisch-hitch/

Just an update on my Blake's.
I do have it working correctly now.
Have found that the rope may just have been new and still very stiff.
After running through several knots on it, I seem to have 'broken it in'.

Nice to have this 'old' favorite of mine back!

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8 years 9 months ago #137495 by olddawg
Replied by olddawg on topic Getting back into this
The sport of this has been secondary to removing a tree that has a potential problem.

I see now if I get into this 'sport', I will need a new harness.
My 'Climber's harness' just doesn't cut it for 'Open Air' ascent.

I'll check you're 'search engine' for I'm sure you've discussed this.
If not, I'll start a topic.

So far, I like the Schwabisch as a back-up to my Croll and my Fusion (like my Fusion better just because I don't like the Teeth of the Croll). My Blake's is still not gathering slack like either of the previous.

I really wish to hear from those that use.
Do you consider the Schwabisch to be 'Life Safety'?

Actually, what knots do you consider to be 'Life Safety'?

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8 years 9 months ago #137498 by moss
Replied by moss on topic Getting back into this
6mm is really small diameter for a hitch cord for tree climbing. 8mm and 10mm are the diameters that work best for DRT. Beeline, Oceans Polyester, Armor Prus and many other cords designed for the purpose are excellent for tree climbing.

You 're never going to get a Blake's to work well with a dynamic or static rope. Ropes designed for arborist use in the 11-13mm range work very well with a Blake's

There are many hitches that are life support quality when used with and eye-2-eye hitch cord. What's more important is to use a hitch cord that is life support quality and is designed and intended for use as a hitch cord in tree climbing.
-AJ
The following user(s) said Thank You: olddawg

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8 years 9 months ago #137499 by olddawg
Replied by olddawg on topic Getting back into this

moss wrote: 6mm is really small diameter for a hitch cord for tree climbing. 8mm and 10mm are the diameters that work best for DRT. Beeline, Oceans Polyester, Armor Prus and many other cords designed for the purpose are excellent for tree climbing.

You 're never going to get a Blake's to work well with a dynamic or static rope. Ropes designed for arborist use in the 11-13mm range work very well with a Blake's

There are many hitches that are life support quality when used with and eye-2-eye hitch cord. What's more important is to use a hitch cord that is life support quality and is designed and intended for use as a hitch cord in tree climbing.
-AJ


I'm running an 11mm as base line and working on a good hitch line for life support. I agree that the Two Eyed is the way to go. Short of the Blake's (just doesn't retrieve slack as I wish), and short of using my Croll (which has served me well in my Rock Climbing Days), do you have a suggestion for me to try?

I'm sitting on a Schwabisch right now with a second Schwabisch as a back-up. Seems rather 'busy' on my rope and not seeing the need. Double eyed on each, quality rope (no Box Store crap here.. Sterling)

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8 years 9 months ago #137500 by olddawg
Replied by olddawg on topic Getting back into this
Almost forgot... Thank you Moss.

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8 years 9 months ago #137502 by moss
Replied by moss on topic Getting back into this

olddawg wrote: I'm running an 11mm as base line and working on a good hitch line for life support. I agree that the Two Eyed is the way to go. Short of the Blake's (just doesn't retrieve slack as I wish), and short of using my Croll (which has served me well in my Rock Climbing Days), do you have a suggestion for me to try?

I'm sitting on a Schwabisch right now with a second Schwabisch as a back-up. Seems rather 'busy' on my rope and not seeing the need. Double eyed on each, quality rope (no Box Store crap here.. Sterling)


Climbing DRT you shouldn't need a backup hitch. I'm not sure what you mean when you say you can't "retrieve slack" with the Blakes.

In general it's tough to answer your questions because I don't really know how you're configuring your climbing system. Perhaps some photos of your setup would be helpful to understand what you're doing.

Also... have you taken a look at Jeff Jepson's "Tree Climber's Companion"? Invaluable resource for tree climbers. Also Treeman's tree climbing basics DVD is something that would be very helpful to look at.
-AJ

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