cambium saver on next branch

This is sort of a spinoff from the previous topic. I'm curious about what method of cambium saver/false crotch/nothing(!) that folks use on the second and third pitch. If you use a monkey fist, bag, or biner on the rope end, it precludes setting a double-ring friction saver in the higher branches (which needs a throw line). Leather sleeves don't seem to be much available for some reason, and Dan House sleeves are heavy and can bend too sharply on the smaller diameter branches. So what do you use?

ART Rope Guide is what you're looking for...that is if you're able to spend $200 on a friction saver!

love
nick

Hey cc,
If you want leather sleeves, just go into your local shoe-repair shop. The guy in my town was more than happy to oblige, and he only charged me about 10 bucks each!
Of course they might not know anything about what we do for fun, so you might have to put up with some ribbing about being an adult doing a child's activity!

We are able to get leather cambium savers from Lighthouse Leather in Maine. Their website is: http://users.aol.com/smscott/inv.htm

Follow the Lighthouse Leathergoods link to tree climbing. I use the 24" 8-10 oz (thickest available). 5" refers to the raw size of the leather. It is sewn into a tube and riveted at the ends (for another 1$). After I get the savers, they are straight. I wet them and place them over a piece of garden hose in a soft arc and slowly dry them so it retains it soft curve.

The phone number is on the website. If you call, ask for the item that he made for Dick Flowers. This is the best one, in my not so humble opinion.

These leather savers set without much difficulty, as light, and don't cause nearly as big a bump on your head if you take one.

Bob
Tree Climbing for All
www.arborquest.org

FWIW, I called New Tribe last week to ask about these, and Lighthouse is who Barbara suggested that I contact.

This will get you to the leather sleeves:

http://users.aol.com/smscott/goods.htm

I order the last one on the list. It is the thickest leather. I also order it with a rivet on each end.

2 seasons so far, with no signs of wear. I would guess many years of recreational use.

Bob

Here are my comments about the leather cambium saver from Lighthouse Leather.

I used one last weekend while climbing with Jay (kernsloth) and am quite pleased with it--it worked beautifully.

I have model RFrwr5, which is 24 inches long and of the thickest-grade leather (1/4-inch thick at the thickest point; minimum 3/16 inch). It cost $19.50 and had both ends riveted for another dollar.

It comes “unformed”--a straight tube--so the user must bend it to the desired shape. I made it flexible for bending by soaking it in water. Just put it in the sink and cover it with water.

After about five minutes (it was quite flexible by then), I plugged one end with a piece of paper towel, packed the tube with sand, and then plugged the other end with another piece of paper towel. (In case you hadn’t thought of it, you have to pack something inside the tube to keep it from collapsing and kinking while you’re bending it.) I can’t think of anything better to use than sand. Let us all know if you have some other reasonable ideas.

Then I started bending the tube into a horseshoe shape so it would fit over a limb about eight or nine inches in diameter (choose your own dimension). I started at one end, bending only a few inches of the tube’s length, then shifted my hands to bend the adjacent few inches. I continued this process, working my way from one end to the other. I worked slowly, repeatedly working my way from one end to the other, bending it a little more each time until I got it in the shape I wanted. (Of course, I bent it so the seam was on the outside of the curve.)

I let it set for several hours (four or five, as I recall), checking it occasionally to nudge it back into shape (it drifted only a little). (You could set it between two heavy objects to hold it in place.) Then I unplugged the ends, shook out the sand, and flushed it with a garden hose.

It dried out after a day or so, and I whacked it several times on a hard surface to dislodge any sand that may have been caught in the seam where the leather is joined (only a few grains had stuck).

Although it fits around an eight-inch-diameter branch “just right,” it will spread to fit a 12- or 13-inch-diameter branch without undue stretching. I can’t say how small a branch it would fit before beginning to kink.

That’s it.

If I were to do this over, here is what I’d do differently:
--I *may* not get the rivets (I don’t think they’re necessary, yet they’re not costly and are cheap insurance to preclude the lacing from coming loose at the ends).
--I would pull a plastic shopping bag through the tube (to act as a liner) to prevent sand from getting on the leather. I don’t believe this is necessary, yet it probably is a better way to do it. If the shopping bag idea works (it should), one could use dirt instead of sand (maybe dirt could be used anyway).
--I would see if I could arrange another shipping method: he (understandably) ships by UPS so he can have accurate tracking of the shipment, yet the shipping cost was about $9.00. This is pretty high overhead for a $20 order.
--I might get one in the thinner leather (but the same length): it’s about $8 cheaper, and I rather doubt that I will ever do enough climbing to wear it out!

As for the length required, consider that the tube need cover only about half the circumference of the limb, so a 24-inch one is good for about a 15-inch diameter branch. The 16-inch one is okay for a 10-inch branch. Think you’ll need the 36-inch one?

Am I satisfied? You bet.

(Standard disclaimer of no relationship whatsoever with the seller, etc.)

I learned a trick from Dick Flowers. He places a section of garden hose through the saver, soaks in water, curves it, and dries it. The last batch we did had to be speed dried cause we needed them right away. They ended up quite rigid, but have since softened. The ones dried slowly are much softer right away.

I have used some thinner leather savers and they tend to bunch up rather than slide over the branch.

Lastly, I have tried to form them as a "J" with the leading end straight. They seem to go over the branch smooooothly (with many "o"s).

No comment on the rivets, but $1 seemed too cheap to pass up.

Just my $.02

Robbity Bob
www.arborquest.org

I wonder if tubular webbing would work as a rope sleeve. It probably wouldn't last as long, but would be very easy to replace.

love
nick

I used a section of webbing on a lanyard I made from climbing rope. I ended up cutting it off. If doesn't slide down the rope well. Also, it often bunched up when I was trying to pass it over a branch.

My thought was that it would proctect the rope and lessen the wear on the rope. After about 6 climbs the webbing was all fuzzy.

Just my $.02

Robbity Bob
www.arborquest.org

Originally posted by cc

So what do you use?

Leather cambium saver from Sherrills. This was a few years back. From my modest experience, I've found it to be very simple and consistent. It's very easy to set with slip knots and working end carabiners (DRT obviously). Once set, it feeds rope smoothly and consistently/predictably. The biggest variable, in my experience, is the amount of tree trunk the rope is rubbing across. I almost always tie into a crotch with the rope around the trunk, so unless the trunk diameter is small, there's almost always rope/bark contact. But even so, the leather cambium savior helps a lot, and it's good for small branches, which might be a downfall of conduit. Once, I brought down my rope, forgetting to tie a slipknot to bring down the cambium saver. For the next two weeks, it rained and stormed intermitently on my marooned c.s., but when I finally got a chance to climb up to retrieve it, it was as good as new. :cool:

I'm glad to hear that there are quite a few people using cambium savers of some sort. What our ropes do to the young bark at the tops of trees is quite harsh.

Whether you're doing it for the trees or for your equipment, keep it up!

love
nick

From the replies to this post, it appears that everyone uses a leather sleeve on pitches beyond the first. Is there anyone who has found it useful (and goes to the trouble) to use a two-ring friction saver on secondary pitches? What do they teach in the Georgia courses once you are off the ground?