A new Fire Storm!

Jim,

Sorry I couldn't make it to Bob's, and I should send him an appology too, though I planned to do so. I was detained by an irate wife and a wallet that couldn't hold enough dough to pay the gas man...I didn't even get to climb that weekend!

I understand your point, insulation on a residential appliance, your blender, or your extension cord, is quite safe, it is in fact an insulator. My comment was in direct relation to house supply lines. I was told that (that the "insulation" on those lines is nothing but weatherproofing) by an electrician to whom I had related a story. The story goes that my father was working on a house installing gutters. One corner of the house had the powerline attached slightly above the gutter that my father was planning to install. He carefully climbed the ladder carrying the gutter to avoid the line, drove the spike& ferrul slightly into the rafter tail while carefully avoiding the powerline now slightly behind his right arm. It was at this point that habbit kicked in and he jerked his estwing hammer back to slam that spike home when his hammer came into close proximity with the line, he did not hit the wire. All I remember from the base of the ladder was a poping noise, similar to a firecracker, and the shadow of my father flying off the ladder.

I'm with Nick, go climb in the forest. There are plenty of good trees there to climb far away from power lines.

Climb Safe!
Icabod

Wow! Quite a story, Cam!

I certainly can't (and won't) argue with facts. All I can say is that there must have been a break/crack/fracture in the insulation. That SE stuff is really tough, but certainly can be abraded or cut . . . and apparently was.

I can't explain how there was a popping sound if there was no metal-to-metal contact between the electrical wire and the ladder (maybe via a metal hammer). The residential voltage is only 120VAC above ground to either of the "hot" wires, low enough that contact would be necessary.

I could give several reasons why the situation could not happen, but I rather believe that both you and your father have overwhelming evidence that it indeed did happen!

Agreed: Climb in the woods. Rattlesnakes and copperheads are basically quite shy and generally will get out of our way; they dislike us more than we dislike them. They are much less likely to do harm to us than is Reddy Kilowatt.

Stay well--

Reddy Kilowatt ? ?
Now you really got my heart pumping!
J.W., You sure we’re not family? Or perhaps we did a substation commissioning job together back in the 80’s? Got any IBEW stories?

Ya know Reddy is still around.
Seeing Reddy is more like an Elvis sighting now-a-days but I know he’s out there.

(photo off of a tee shirt my wife got from her work)

Later,
Ej

I was like 8 at the time, so like 22 years of memory might change ('specially given all my head injuries on the skateboard)

I assure you it's true (the story, to the best of my recolection) the part about the insulation, though, I'd really like information from the big guys at my local electrical supplier.

The poping may have been from the ladder in retrospect. My own shocking experience went long with a noise, but it was the sound of my own screaming. That's why I don't mess with free flowing electrons!

Climb Safe!
Icabod

Well, I think that I accomplished my goal of getting some discussion going on this topic. I see that many of you read the Treebuzz site and their take on this topic including the misinformation. I appreciate Jake's input and his views from someone that actually works with electricity and knows the field better than me. Thanks everyone. Job well done. Now on to the next topic!

Electrojake, after I had mentioned “Reddy Kilowatt,” I wondered how many here have heard of him. I can’t recall seeing the name for several years. I should pay attention to the electrical utility trucks and contractor’s trucks to see if the symbol is there. I used to have a Reddy Kilowatt lapel pin—sure wish I knew where it was.


No, I don’t believe we’re family, and I’m pretty sure we haven’t worked together (although from your posts, I’m sure I would have enjoyed that). While in college, I worked summer jobs for Potomac Edison in Western Maryland back in the . . . ohmygracious . . . late 1950s!

I didn’t have a “real” job with the utilities—did my work in electronics. I did do some consulting about 15 years ago for Delmarva Power (they now have a new name) in Delaware. I really enjoyed being around the engineers who designed the long-lines stuff—very educational.

Cam, as you commented, our memories indeed are not all that trustworthy (skateboard injuries or not!). One psychotherapist I used to work with was fond of saying that she took clients’ direct reports as “unsubstantiated rumors, at best.”

My guess about the popping noise is that the ladder itself came into contact with a live wire and current flowed through it to ground; that could do it. We’ll never know . . . and experimentation to recreate the situation is discouraged by me!

One thing I have seen with service lines is where squirrels have gnawed away the protective insulating covering. I have also seen these same animals nearly cut entirely through the bare support wire.

Industry standard in arboriculture says not to go within 10 feet of any energized line, including telephone lines (they are energized you know, but to a small degree), unless you have special training.

The top lines on the pole out by the street are the most powerful. You know they are the real things when you see ceramic supports being used to keep them suspended. That is the give away. I have seen these same high powered lines closer to the ground on poles too. One climber got instantly killed when he brushed against one while climbing a tree. He actually caught on fire! This high powered feeder line (primary line) was no higher than 15 feet off the ground on the pole and cut across a back ally.

I personally nearly got killed when I misjudged a trimming cut and laid the tip of a branch on a primary line. The branch tips immediately caught on fire and I got a huge jolt up my arm! If it had not been a branch tip I would not be here today to tell you about it because the burning tip gave way and the branch swung down.

I have been told that the oil of one’s hand on a throw line is enough to conduct a charge down the line and possibly kill you if you get it over a main primary line. I am not going to do research with personal experience to give you the results as I did in the above instance.

If you must trim around your own personal power lines, get a professional to do it or call the power company and they will drop your lines so you can do the work in safety. You just need to call them back when you are finished so they can hook it back up. Around Atlanta they do it for free. You just have to be there when they drop the lines.

Jim,
Of course, Tri-plex in free air is safe if the insulation in intact. 120/240 single phase requires direct contact to move current to ground or neutral. That's entirely different from high voltage. Voltage is like pressure in water. The more you have, the farther the stuff will jump.
Why not just bury the wire. If I missed that in this thread, my apologies.
Robert Crook