Bought Trango Cinch, Not Too Impressed

Okay, I've been chewing on this decision for about 6 months now, and finally decided to buy a trango cinch today, and it took less than 6 minutes to realize that it was a mistake!

My decision was between the Trango Cinch, the Petzl Grigri. I wanted to put together a RADS system for SRT climbing, where I could use the belay device to Rapidly Ascend and Decend along with a handled ascender and some foot straps.

Why I bought the Cinch over the Grigri:

Smaller than grigri
A little cheaper
Rope tails down, not up
Rope runs through easier than grigri
Cinches down faster than grigri
Does not allow rope-slip, like grigri


Why it was a mistake:

As it turns out, the cinch is a little too small. The handle is almost too small to be functional, and it doesn't appear to be as sturdy as the gri gri. I read about this being a problem, but I also read that it had been solved by the manufacturer. . .

I was excited by the prospect of having a belay device where the rope tails down. However, this is misleading because you can only pull rope through by pulling up, just like a grigri. So this is a moot point.

Well, the rope feeds through easier, but when loaded, the device cinches down on it so hard that it's difficult to get the rope running again. in fact (and i'm not sure this is bad but) it seemed to flatten my blaze rope.

While it doesnt allow rope to slip (good), it also doesnt allow much rope adjustment (bad). i tried using it on my lanyard, and i couldnt get it to pay out rope under load!

anyway, i'm pretty disapointed with its performance. i should add that i was able to decend SRT in a smooth and controlled manner. i know i'm not using it the way it was designed, so i cant complain too much. i would just like to get more information out about it so that someone else doesnt make the same mistake. here's some pictures for anyone interested.

here's a picture of it open. notice how straight and deceptive the path of the rope is.

Looking at the cinch I think it compares with my Ushba Basic but with a descend handle.

If you like to DdRT try using it in place of a Blakes hitch:

Tie a biner with an anchor hitch on a split tail at a lenght that you can reach the handle.

Pass the down rope thru the cinch and then attach your up rope to the biner on the cinch.

As you pull down the cinch will self-advance and pull you up via the split-tail.

To descend use the handle to rock the cinch.

If the handle is released you should stop so try it low and slow and let us know.

See you at the top,
Dan

Treetramp, I just received my USHBA ascender and it works very nice as I saw in your previous get togethers. I have not figured out how to make it release to descend but I assume that since it is an"ascender" it was not designed to be used going down. Your suggestion to Sitka sounds like a nice idea. I have used the Grigri in a RADS set up and it works fine. It is a little gear intensive but it has its place in any climber that like to explore new horizons and new ways to use their extra gear toys.

Sitka, use that trango for you lanyard adjuster!

RADS=Rope Ascending Descending System...Google it for more information

Actually, according to this climbing glossary, RADS is

"An abbreviation of radicals, it was once a pejorative used by traditional climbers "trads" to show disdain for their brash - and often obnoxious - sport climbing brethren. But now these upstarts have embraced the term and it is only considered derogatory by die-hard trads. The rivalry still remains, and occassionally gets heated, with both sides making legitimate arguments. Unfortunately, the noise to signal ratio is often higher than one might hope. It's kind of like the Hatfields vs. the McCoys."

http://www.touchstoneclimbing.com/glossary_items.html




And of course, we are all familiar with the traditional acronym, RADS, as

"The Radar Acquisition and Display System (RADS) is a moveable system designed to record and display data from a research Doppler radar with polarization diversity."

and to a lesser extent, Reactive Airways Dysfunction Syndrome (RADS)

Explaination of what you see:

Ushba is used like a LockJack and is self-advancing.

Pulling down on the down rope with both hands and both feet makes the working end with the "8" pull up the biner.

As the biner rises, your harness is connected to it via the web to delta on your harness.

Having the web section allows the rig to be at head height where your pulls are the strongest.

To descent you rock the Ushba back easy and it releases its pressure; dont rock too hard or fast until you get the "feel"; or you can better control your descent by threading your down rope thru a biner for braking control.

My top reasons to use this:
Most easiest DdRT rig I haved used;
goes up and down easy; easy to adjust and set;
costs 100's less than LockJack;
Titanium!!!!!!!!!!! is so cool.

See you at the top,
Dan

hey TreeTramp, i think you tried to post a picture but i cant see it. would you try again because im very interested in your self advancing Ddrt system.

also, i have been monkeying around with my cinch and i think its not as bad as i originally thought. maybe my expectations were just too high!

My 2 cents worth on the “Cinch” and other such alloy gadgets. . .
I like gadgets and stuff.
To be honest, I probably enjoy my tree climbing “stuff” as much as I like actually climbing the trees. I have saddles and stuff, rope and stuff, alloy gadgets and stuff. I even have a “stuff” category for my throw bags, throw lines, and line mugs.

So my point here is. . .
If you’re disappointed with your Trango Cinch, simply toss it in your alloy “stuff” bag and in a few months, or even a few years, you’ll get an idea or an urge to try a new way of climbing. You’ll dig into your gadget bag, grab the Cinch, and be onto new adventures. The Cinch may eventually become your favorite gadget!

And Tree Tramp. . .
I second Sitka’s request.
When time permits, please try to re-submit your photo here on the forum. I know that your gear set-up’s are always intriguing!

Thanks!
-Ej-

Link to Everest products USHBA

http://store.everestgear.com/421090.html

I hope that you can follow this link to the photos:

Kodak Photo Share Site

treetramp, I tried out that self-advancing method of yours (with friction hitch because cinch doesnt tail down well) and I managed to get myself stuck a few feet off the ground. Laughable! Climbing was so easy that I didn’t even think about how my hitch was way out of reach. So, when I went to pull myself up to get it, my rope just advanced even further out of reach, like a dog chasing his tail! Of course, I managed to get myself down, but not gracefully by any means. Now, my questions is, how do you descend when using that method? I’m still trying to think of a good way, but it’s not coming to me. I tried shortening the webbing so that I could reach my hitch at all times, but it seemed to defeat the ease of ascension.

Well now; I know all about chasing my tail.

I am glad that you found out how easy it is to ascend but have one change to request. The biner used for your friction hitch would be stronger linked to the loop biner and not in the eye of the rope.

I have adjusted my web to an exact length so I can still hold the Ushba to rock it back to descend. With your hitch it adds several inches more to reach but should still be doable. Also I found that when I did rig to out of reach I needed to land on a limb; secure with my lanyard and reattach the biner closer so it is well within my reach.

You can also use a section of rope instead of the web where the end is attached to your delta and then goes thru the biner and ties with a Blakes hitch back on itself so the lenght is adjustable.

Keep on trying low and slow.

See you at the top,
dan