What's inside your beer knot?

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11 years 6 months ago - 11 years 6 months ago #133011 by Davej
What's inside your beer knot? was created by Davej
Not visible for inspection? Here's an example story...

Byline: Mike Wells

Jun. 25--Portable rock wall owner Marcus Floyd will pay $700,000 to the parents of the Jefferson City woman who died last summer from injuries resulting from a fall from his equipment.

When a cable snapped on July 14, 22-year-old Christine Ewing dropped 20 feet to the asphalt outside a Mid-Missouri Mavericks baseball game at the University of Missouri-Columbia. She died later at University Hospital.

The settlement in the subsequent wrongful death suit came June 14, just one day before a trial jury deadlocked 10-2 in the criminal case against Floyd, a Columbia resident who still faces a charge of second-degree involuntary manslaughter.

http://www.courttv.com/trials/taped/floyd/background.html
Last edit: 11 years 6 months ago by Davej.

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11 years 6 months ago #133012 by Baker
Replied by Baker on topic Re:What's inside your beer knot?
Am I missing something? I don't see the beer knot connection.

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11 years 6 months ago #133013 by Davej
Replied by Davej on topic Re:What's inside your beer knot?

Baker wrote:
Am I missing something? I don't see the beer knot connection.


\"Police recovered the cable, which failed examination. When they peeled back an outer layer of black rubber, they found a corroded, frayed cable bandaged in duct tape.\"

The tragedy leads me to wonder about any life safety item hidden away such that it cannot be visually inspected. A beer knot is only half hidden. Can it be inspected?

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11 years 6 months ago #133014 by michaeljspraggon
Replied by michaeljspraggon on topic Re:What's inside your beer knot?
Hi there. It's been a while since I posted!

Regarding beer knots. I would think that slippage is very unlikely in a tight beer knot and you should be able to check for this by feeling the tail of the hidden end inside the outer tubular webbing. Regarding internal damage: If it was tied with webbing in pristine condition then it won't get a chance to fray inside the outer webbing. Also, rope or webbing doesn't tend to break in the middle of a knot.

My thoughts, although I've never actually tied a beer knot myself!

Michael

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11 years 6 months ago #133016 by Baker
Replied by Baker on topic Re:What's inside your beer knot?
Correct you are Michael.

There is always going to be some part of ANY knot that is hidden and cannot be inspected unless it is untied. The thing is, hidden \"Inside\" is the safest place to be for a piece of webbing or rope. No damage can occur to that particular piece of material if it is inside something else.

The piece of equipment in the article was taken apart, repaired poorly and then the repair intentionally covered up. It did not break because it couldn't be inspected. It broke because the previous owner, the seller, was a scumbag.

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11 years 6 months ago #133022 by oldtimer
Replied by oldtimer on topic Re:What's inside your beer knot?
Well I am not sure what this rock wall accident has to do with Tree Climbing and ropes but it clearly shows a few faults on the part of the owner: Poor Supervision of staff operating the ride, Improper permits, Not Professional Inspection the equipment and replacements according to the manufacturer guidelines, Not adult present to operate, supervise and operate the ride among others too long to mention.

Inspecting knots and its proper use is the responsibility of the user period. No excuses. No way to try to blame the manufacturer of the rope or sling strap.

If you watch a lot of the videos on line of Rope and slings testing they show that knots fail mostly where the tail enters the bend of the knot and not inside the knot. Sherril and many others have posted videos on line of scientific testing of ropes in combination with metal gear, etc. Check them out.
They are very educational. :laugh:

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11 years 6 months ago #133023 by michaeljspraggon
Replied by michaeljspraggon on topic Re:What's inside your beer knot?
I'm always wary of using any perishable equipment such as ropes or slings that I don't know the history of. Particularly if it is likely to have been left outdoors where wet or freezing weather can damage it.

Even things such as galvanised steel cable can look fine but be fatigued and snap like a matchstick. Once I found what looked like a perfectly good camming device half way up a rock route, which snapped at one of the thick steel cables as soon as I tried to pull it out of the crack. Dynamic rope can be damaged internally by grit or having taken a big fall or bent around a sharp radius, while the outer sheath looks intact.

Aluminium Carabiners are less likely to be fatigued by normal usage, although Aluminium, unlike steel, will continue to become fatigued even at low loadings, so very old or visibly damaged carabiners should still be avoided.

I would always inspect anyone else's equipment visually and if in doubt, ask them about the history of it. Beyond that it's up to you whether to trust it.

Michael

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